Vintage Gruen
The forum for Gruen watch enthusiasts.
Home » The Gruen Model Database » 1920's » Cartouche 260 - diamonds with enamel
Cartouche 260 - diamonds with enamel [message #15507] Wed, 15 September 2021 18:17 Go to next message
Jenneke is currently offline  Jenneke
Messages: 1921
Registered: May 2013
Location: Netherlands
Gruen Authority
Model name: cartouche 260
Type: cartouche
Period/date: 1927/1928
Gender: ladies

Case Maker: gruen
Case Material: 14k white gold
Case Serial: 1146665
Case Style no: 66

Caliber: 107 (precision 17 jewels)
Movement Maker: gruen
Movement Serial: 618155

Bracelet: tbd

Other info: 6 diamonds and inlaid black enamel

/vgforum/index.php?t=getfile&id=8514&private=0
/vgforum/index.php?t=getfile&id=8515&private=0
/vgforum/index.php?t=getfile&id=8520&private=0
/vgforum/index.php?t=getfile&id=8518&private=0

You can only waste time if you forget to enjoy it - Loesje

[Updated on: Wed, 27 October 2021 15:40]

Report message to a moderator

Re: Cartouche diamonds with enamel [message #15508 is a reply to message #15507] Wed, 15 September 2021 18:20 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Jenneke is currently offline  Jenneke
Messages: 1921
Registered: May 2013
Location: Netherlands
Gruen Authority
Maybe one of the Mode du bijou models but cant find a match.

Haven’t cleaned it yet. It has enamel on the lug ends. Question is, was it on the other sides also inlaid. Any thoughts?

You can only waste time if you forget to enjoy it - Loesje

Report message to a moderator

Re: Cartouche diamonds with enamel [message #15512 is a reply to message #15508] Wed, 15 September 2021 18:57 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Barney Green
Messages: 1751
Registered: February 2014
Location: Wolfsburg, Germany
Gruen Authority
Hi Jennecke,

very niche score! I think this is a Carouche 260, isn't it?

Barney

Gruen, Gruen, Gruen ist alles was ich habe... Gruen, Gruen, Gruen is all I have...(German folklore song)

Report message to a moderator

Re: Cartouche diamonds with enamel [message #15514 is a reply to message #15512] Wed, 15 September 2021 21:10 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Jenneke is currently offline  Jenneke
Messages: 1921
Registered: May 2013
Location: Netherlands
Gruen Authority
Overlooked this one but would say, a match! My case only 8 numbers lower. Same batch?

The picture of this watch is in my book very blurry and dark. Cant see where the enamel is. Anyone with a better picture?

And a score it was. Bought it without seeing the guts but recognised the back engraving as a 14k suspect. Was expecting a cal 155 but happy with a new caliber in my collection.

You can only waste time if you forget to enjoy it - Loesje

Report message to a moderator

Re: Cartouche diamonds with enamel [message #15515 is a reply to message #15508] Wed, 15 September 2021 21:15 Go to previous messageGo to next message
afire is currently offline  afire
Messages: 1331
Registered: May 2013
Location: Wisconsin
Gruen Authority
Jenneke wrote on Wed, 15 September 2021 13:20
It has enamel on the lug ends. Question is, was it on the other sides also inlaid. Any thoughts?
I suspect the answer is "not exactly." There were several men's watches that had hard vitreous inlaid enamel champlevé on the lug ends, but not on the side "rails". Here are a couple I've owned.

Quadron 10 - the ends are real enamel, the sides are black paint added by me (also, so as to avoid any undue confusion, the movement/dial were temporarily borrowed from Quadron 7 [see below] while original was being worked on).
https://photos.smugmug.com/Music/Hotlinking/i-GMvMCnn/0/b5216838/XL/photo%20%2823%29-XL.jpg

Tank 13 - I left this one plain. The engravings are too small and fine for flooding with black paint, and maybe it was never there.
https://photos.smugmug.com/Music/Hotlinking/i-MvfTFfc/1/571e3d77/XL/image-XL.jpg

However, my guess would be that your watch probably came from the factory with some sort of matte black painted shading in the side engravings. That's how my Quadron 7 is, and it was basically in NOS condition when I got it, so I don't have any doubt that this is the original treatment.
https://photos.smugmug.com/Music/Hotlinking/i-3NDCvDx/0/c7d86673/XL/IMG_0010-XL.jpg

Report message to a moderator

Re: Cartouche diamonds with enamel [message #15516 is a reply to message #15515] Wed, 15 September 2021 21:52 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Ephemerald
Messages: 1039
Registered: October 2018
Location: City of Lake Salt
Gruen Authority
Gruen called that "antique finish", the not enamel type that's on yr quad 7.

Matthias

Report message to a moderator

Re: Cartouche diamonds with enamel [message #15517 is a reply to message #15515] Wed, 15 September 2021 22:00 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Jenneke is currently offline  Jenneke
Messages: 1921
Registered: May 2013
Location: Netherlands
Gruen Authority
The last one is “antique finished engraving” in Gruen terminology. It does help to let the pattern stand out. Maybe I try a little paint. 😊

Edit: Matthew beat me while i was searching and answering. Double answer it is.

You can only waste time if you forget to enjoy it - Loesje

[Updated on: Wed, 15 September 2021 22:02]

Report message to a moderator

Re: Cartouche diamonds with enamel [message #15525 is a reply to message #15517] Thu, 16 September 2021 16:08 Go to previous messageGo to next message
afire is currently offline  afire
Messages: 1331
Registered: May 2013
Location: Wisconsin
Gruen Authority
Right. What I'm getting at is that my guess is that many of these watches with true enamel on the lug and and engravings along the side rails of the bezel, likely had those engravings shaded with matte black, as in the "antique finished engraving".

Report message to a moderator

Re: Cartouche diamonds with enamel [message #15529 is a reply to message #15525] Thu, 16 September 2021 17:40 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Case is currently offline  Case
Messages: 1178
Registered: May 2019
Location: Cincinnati
Gruen Authority
That's a stunner, even as is. It's also first I've seen stamped with a 107/66 pair. Every other 66 I've seen is 155/66, most holding a caliber 107. But this one's case shape (for the top) is also different from the usual 66 rectangle.

Report message to a moderator

Re: Cartouche diamonds with enamel [message #15531 is a reply to message #15525] Thu, 16 September 2021 20:11 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Jenneke is currently offline  Jenneke
Messages: 1921
Registered: May 2013
Location: Netherlands
Gruen Authority
afire wrote on Thu, 16 September 2021 18:08
my guess is that many of these watches with true enamel on the lug and and engravings along the side rails of the bezel, likely had those engravings shaded with matte black
I think that is likely too. Without it the sides are a bit blunt. What kind of paint did you use?


My cartouche 255 has 107 marked inside the case, but contains a cal 155.

And I have a tonneau shaped case with a cal 106 inside. With enamel on the sides… Will put in on the list to make some pictures for the caliber database. They are sister movements with clear differences.

You can only waste time if you forget to enjoy it - Loesje

Report message to a moderator

Re: Cartouche diamonds with enamel [message #15533 is a reply to message #15531] Fri, 17 September 2021 16:25 Go to previous messageGo to next message
afire is currently offline  afire
Messages: 1331
Registered: May 2013
Location: Wisconsin
Gruen Authority
Jenneke wrote on Thu, 16 September 2021 15:11
What kind of paint did you use?
Just Testors flat black. My technique is to sloppily paint over it, wait for it to get tacky, then scrape off the excess. There are probably better techniques and materials that would make it look a little more organic, but it's not something I've put a lot of effort into.

Report message to a moderator

Re: Cartouche diamonds with enamel [message #15570 is a reply to message #15515] Wed, 22 September 2021 19:15 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Ephemerald
Messages: 1039
Registered: October 2018
Location: City of Lake Salt
Gruen Authority
afire wrote on Wed, 15 September 2021 15:15


Tank 13 - I left this one plain. The engravings are too small and fine for flooding with black paint, and maybe it was never there.
https://photos.smugmug.com/Music/Hotlinking/i-MvfTFfc/1/571e3d77/XL/image-XL.jpg
It was there. Not black paint but the finish. The 1927 Stock Record Book shows a clear image of Tank 13 showing finish on the sides with the text "Engraved enameled and antique finished".
I think it looks fine as is. I have a Strap 88, one with the original antique finish and one where someone removed it. Looks like completely different models. I left it as is.
There are several YouTube vids showing how to do chemical oxidations and antique finishes on precious metals.

Matthias

[Updated on: Wed, 22 September 2021 19:42]

Report message to a moderator

Re: Cartouche diamonds with enamel [message #15572 is a reply to message #15570] Wed, 22 September 2021 20:13 Go to previous messageGo to next message
afire is currently offline  afire
Messages: 1331
Registered: May 2013
Location: Wisconsin
Gruen Authority
[quote title=Ephemerald wrote on Wed, 22 September 2021 14:15]afire wrote on Wed, 15 September 2021 15:15
There are several YouTube vids showing how to do chemical oxidations and antique finishes on precious metals.
Ooh, that sounds interesting. I'll have to look for one next time I'm doing that sort of thing. If you have one to recommend, I'll take it.

Report message to a moderator

Re: Cartouche diamonds with enamel [message #15649 is a reply to message #15572] Wed, 27 October 2021 15:51 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Jenneke is currently offline  Jenneke
Messages: 1921
Registered: May 2013
Location: Netherlands
Gruen Authority
And here she is with the antique finished engraving on the sides. Little black acrylic paint did the job.

/vgforum/index.php?t=getfile&id=8606&private=0

Also added a period correct filigree strap that has definitely lived her life. Smile

/vgforum/index.php?t=getfile&id=8607&private=0

You can only waste time if you forget to enjoy it - Loesje

Report message to a moderator

Re: Cartouche diamonds with enamel [message #15650 is a reply to message #15649] Wed, 27 October 2021 15:59 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Gary
Messages: 2121
Registered: May 2013
Location: Left Coast
Gruen Authority
Cheerleader
Very nice! Flash

Report message to a moderator

Re: Cartouche diamonds with enamel [message #15652 is a reply to message #15649] Thu, 28 October 2021 13:29 Go to previous message
Case is currently offline  Case
Messages: 1178
Registered: May 2019
Location: Cincinnati
Gruen Authority
Well done, Jenneke!

Report message to a moderator

Previous Topic: Import Tank
Next Topic: Cartouche 366
Goto Forum:
  

[ Syndicate this forum (XML) ] [ RSS ] [ PDF ]

Current Time: Wed Jan 15 06:46:26 UTC 2025

Total time taken to generate the page: 0.01588 seconds
.:: Contact :: Home ::.

Powered by: FUDforum 3.1.3.
Copyright ©2001-2023 FUDforum Bulletin Board Software