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Strap 570 [message #17390] Mon, 03 October 2022 04:43 Go to next message
Ephemerald
Messages: 1039
Registered: October 2018
Location: City of Lake Salt
Gruen Authority
Gruens have many dial variants, so that's one reason we ID a Gruen by it's case. But what about when the watchcase looks like this?


/vgforum/index.php?t=getfile&id=9994&private=0



No doubt a genuine model based off this photo from my copy of "Masterbook" (Flex bracelet dates to later period)



/vgforum/index.php?t=getfile&id=9995&private=0



Did Gruen just slap on a diff dial on a Pan Am Ace case n call it good? Probably!

But the point of this post is to assign a name to my watch. This watch has an inscription with a date:1948.


First one I find with my model is August 1948. "Gruen Veri-Thin Pan American" Interesting but I too thought it must be a mistake.

/vgforum/index.php?t=getfile&id=9996&private=0



Thought:1948 is a year that Gruen was the official timepiece of Pan American Airways.

Second ad is in June 48 for Father's Day sale.


/vgforum/index.php?t=getfile&id=9997&private=0




Thought: While most Pan Ams are Veri-Thins, they are seldom advertised or classified this way. It usually goes in order Gruen Pan American "Ace". They keep calling Strap 570 model "Veri-Thin Pan American".

Third ad is June 1948 Father's Day again, wait is this a National ad campaign?


/vgforum/index.php?t=getfile&id=10001&private=0







Normally three separate ads is enough for me to accept a Gruen Watch model name. But I'm STILL skeptical but important clue in that last ad; Esquire. Yes, Strap 570 featured in a nation wide ad campaign. What is the name of my watch?

Matthias

[Updated on: Mon, 03 October 2022 05:48]

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Re: Strap 570 [message #17391 is a reply to message #17390] Mon, 03 October 2022 04:52 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Ephemerald
Messages: 1039
Registered: October 2018
Location: City of Lake Salt
Gruen Authority
One more local, will that convince you?

/vgforum/index.php?t=getfile&id=9999&private=0


In fact, there are *numerous* ads saying Strap 570 is called "Veri-Thin Pan American".


With this ad in Esquire, July 1948, showing a new image of Strap 570 from the opposite side, I am absolutely 100% convinced of the name of my watch: "Gruen Veri-Thin Pan American".


/vgforum/index.php?t=getfile&id=10000&private=0

Matthias

[Updated on: Mon, 03 October 2022 05:51]

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Re: Strap 570 [message #17393 is a reply to message #17391] Mon, 03 October 2022 14:01 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Case is currently offline  Case
Messages: 1178
Registered: May 2019
Location: Cincinnati
Gruen Authority
Iā€™m convinced!

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Re: Strap 570 [message #17394 is a reply to message #17393] Mon, 03 October 2022 14:16 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Gary
Messages: 2108
Registered: May 2013
Location: Left Coast
Gruen Authority
Cheerleader
And I'd rather wear this Pan generic dial then the others, clean!

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Re: Strap 570 [message #17395 is a reply to message #17394] Mon, 03 October 2022 14:45 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Barney Green
Messages: 1725
Registered: February 2014
Location: Wolfsburg, Germany
Gruen Authority
You convinced me as well. I have never paid enough attention to become aware of this model being called "Veri-Thin Pan American", but I also have 8 advertisements showing in in 1948. There are some older advertisements which feature different watches under the same name, so I never noticed the consistency in 1948 for this particular watch. Cool ID, so far I have always missed this watch!
Also important is the countercheck if this watch was also advertised under a different name. The check did not bring up a fit, so the ID should be confirmed.

Gruen, Gruen, Gruen ist alles was ich habe... Gruen, Gruen, Gruen is all I have...(German folklore song)

[Updated on: Mon, 03 October 2022 15:16]

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Re: Strap 570 [message #17699 is a reply to message #17395] Thu, 10 November 2022 21:32 Go to previous messageGo to next message
timeliz
Messages: 602
Registered: May 2013
Location: Northern California
Gruen Master
I always thought so... : )...although, mine is an autowind.
https://www.vintagegruen.org/vgforum/index.php?t=msg&th= 211&start=0&

"Some days are diamonds, some days are stones..." -John Denver

[Updated on: Thu, 10 November 2022 22:03]

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Re: Strap 570 [message #17700 is a reply to message #17699] Thu, 10 November 2022 22:09 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Ephemerald
Messages: 1039
Registered: October 2018
Location: City of Lake Salt
Gruen Authority
"I always thought so....:)".

Smile

Always thought so that the "Case bezel style is very similar to the PanAm Ace but larger"?

Ok, I see. What can I say you were ahead of your time seeing the similarities. šŸ‘
But to be clear, my case is completely different model and construction than your case. (Not just size, bezel lip, but back also, and different style...


My hyperbole "did Gruen just throw a diff dial in a Pan Am Ace case?".

In fact was just that. Gruen was of course far more thoughtful, you can see here that it is the bezel and therefore the size of lugs, that really distinguished it from the Ace.

/vgforum/index.php?t=getfile&id=10158&private=0


Thanks for comment. It's nice to see you around again. Def interested in your model, but dates from after Gruen/ PA deal. Do you have a name?

Matthias

[Updated on: Thu, 10 November 2022 22:24]

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Re: Strap 570 [message #17701 is a reply to message #17700] Thu, 10 November 2022 22:31 Go to previous messageGo to next message
timeliz
Messages: 602
Registered: May 2013
Location: Northern California
Gruen Master
Nope, no name & have never seen another like it.

"Some days are diamonds, some days are stones..." -John Denver

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Re: Strap 570 [message #18293 is a reply to message #17701] Sat, 13 May 2023 00:06 Go to previous message
JackW is currently offline  JackW
Messages: 1869
Registered: May 2013
Location: Denver
Gruen Authority
Head Janitor
Site Admin
I picked up one of these recently. I was intrigued by Matt's post on this watch. When I saw one in the swamp the other day, I made a play for it.

/vgforum/index.php?t=getfile&id=10512&private=0

The case as Matt notes has a ridge or raised bevel at the crystal seat:
/vgforum/index.php?t=getfile&id=10515&private=0

What I was interested in was the serial number information. Matt's adverts he shows are June 1948 and another one in Aug 1948. After several hours of sleuthing on my part, I found only one additional advert that show this watch. This advert is from October 1949. It is pretty much the same advert Matt found from Aug '48.

/vgforum/index.php?t=getfile&id=10516&private=0

This give a little more than a year, year and a half, for the watch.... This jives with the following

/vgforum/index.php?t=getfile&id=10513&private=0
/vgforum/index.php?t=getfile&id=10514&private=0

Movement serial is B-580073 which should put this in the 1947-48
Case serial is G929822 which puts it to the 1948/49 production year.

The winding crown is not correct.

I'm also befuddled by the 'X's all over the movement. There are two discernable service marks on the watch.

In the image of the "master book" that Matt shows and also in the version that Bruce S. published, the listing for the strap 570 also indicates that this came in a solid 14k case. That would be interesting to verify.

fyi... the expansion bracelet is not original. It is marked 'Bulova'

All I know is based on hard work & writing by others. I can only aspire to augment this body of knowledge. If I am wrong it is because of my own failings. -me

"If I have seen farther it is by standing on the shoulders of giants." - Newton

[Updated on: Sat, 13 May 2023 00:07]

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